May 17, 2015

“This past legislative session, $512 million of new money, new money going into education” Governor Herbert

 

ANNOUNCER: KUED presents the governor's monthly news conference, an exchange between Utah reporters and Governor Gary Herbert. This program was recorded earlier.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Good morning. I apologize, I have a little bit of laryngitis, kind of an occupational hazard for us elected officials, but I'm honored to be with you and thank you for attending.

I brought with me today a little hat, Utah Honor Flight. I had early this morning the opportunity to go out to the state fairgrounds and wish well a group of our World War II veterans, which are heading to Baltimore, and then they drive into Washington, D.C., to visit the World War II monument. I'm sure most of you know that this year of 2015 is the 70-year anniversary of the end of World War II. We've had about 416,000 casualties in that war. We've had about 16 million strong that signed up and served in that great conflict, World War II, that really I think set Utah—or Utah and America on the pathway of really being the bastion of freedom and liberty in the world.

And we talk about them as the greatest generation. And the example they set for us, as far as service and sacrifice, continues today. With all those millions that signed up, we only have about 2 million of them left. We lose a lot each and every day. And I had a great opportunity to meet with them and their families, and they're proud of their service and what they've done, and we're proud to represent them and to encourage them and recognize their great service and sacrifice, and wish them well. I hope we take the lessons of World War II to heart.

And again, the protection of freedom and liberty that this country stands for, the benefits we have because of their service and sacrifice. It gives us the great quality of life we have in America and here in Utah today, something we should never forget. And I know that our young men and women in uniform today take encouragement and I think incentive from looking and learning about the World War II veterans and others who have served that give them a motivation to serve today.

So, a great tribute for me to be able to go and spend time with these World War II veterans, and a great honor to send them off. And we in Utah will never forget their service and sacrifice. With that, what questions would you like to talk to me about?

ERIC NIELSEN, KUED: Governor, I'd like to open up to today's news conference with Senate Bill 54. And it seems as though Republican leadership is very opposed to the law, but the rank and file and elected officials are kind of split. They're mixed on it. I'm wondering why you think there might be a disconnect between party leadership and the party itself.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, it's an emotional issue. And as one who supports the caucus convention system, I mean, I see the benefits. Again, I've said before I'm probably governor today by virtue of a caucus convention system, where somebody of a minimal meals, I don't have a lot of money, and some minimal name recognition at the time, allowed me to compete with others who had a lot more money and a lot bigger name recognition. And you can compete in the field of ideas. And you have to deal with about 3,600 delegates and you can convince them that you maybe have some good ideas and some policy ideas that would go forward. It allows you to compete on a little more level playing field. So I understand that. I, in fact, support it. The delegates have significant power. And it's probably a little difficult for them to, one, say, "Gee, this is a good policy, a good program.

It's worked well. Why do we give it up?" And two, "We're going to have to give up our own authority to vote." And so there's probably human nature involved in that. I think the way the thing has happened, there's been misunderstanding.

Many in the legislature that voted for Senate Bill 54 support the caucus convention system, but they saw this as a way to protect it and to preserve it, at least in some form or fashion, kind of the old adage that half a loaf is better than no loaf. And it appeared, I think, for many that the polling was such that the public were saying, "Hey, we want to have just a general primary."

The concern for many of us is, does that mean that only the rich and the famous will be able to compete? Because it certainly gives a leg up when it comes to getting your message in a general primary. Those who have got the money can get their message out easier than those who have lesser means.

BOB BERNICK, UTAHPOLICY.COM: Governor, especially in election years, you are seeing and other governors are seeing, as the titular head of the Republican Party. You're running for re-election in 2016.

During the legislative session, James Evans, the current chair, told me that he was going to run for re-election. So I've got two questions for you. One, do you support James Evans as running for re-election of the state party? And two, former Senator Dan Liljenquist has said he's interest in running. "Seriously considering," that is the quote he gave me. Would you support Liljenquist if he ran for state chair?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I think there's probably a number of people that will look at the race, including current chairman, James Evans, as well as others that have been mentioned.

You mentioned Dan Liljenquist. And I think there's probably two or three or four others that maybe are considering it. That's elections.

That's what we—the process is people take a look at the opportunities and see if they've got something to offer, and then will decide whether they throw their hat in the ring or not.

I recognize that Chairman Evans has been the chairman at a difficult time, you know, in this SB54 and the Count My Vote thing has come to the forefront. And so he's had a difficult time, I think, in navigating, you know, what should happen going forward.

I'm more than happy to talk to anybody who wants to talk to me about their candidacy and make a decision at a future date as far as where I would come down on that.

I know that this is one thing for sure and that is whoever we have as the chairman needs to work very diligently to kind of unite the party and bring them together. This kind of civil war that's going on in the Republican ranks is probably not healthy for the party. I'm a Republican and so I'm concerned about this discord that's going on.

And so we need to come together and resolve these differences. And I think whoever the chairman is going to be in the future will do that.

BOB BERNICK, UTAHPOLICY.COM: Are you going to endorse somebody?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Yet to be determined. I've not said I'm going to endorse anybody at the present time. I would want to probably talk to all those who decide to run and make a decision at a later date based on facts and information, not speculation.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS:Governor, are you happy with the way that Chairman Evans is handling this SB54 issue?

I know you expressed some of the same concerns today that you've expressed before about the discord within the party. Since then, the chairman has sent out a survey and seems to be trying to push the party to move forward. Whether it can or not remains to be seen. But are you satisfied he's doing everything he needs to get the party on track for 2016?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I think there's always room for improvement in any elected position. Certainly I'm no exception to that. I'm sure there are things I could do better to get better outcomes. And I expect the same thing would be true with Chairman Evans. And it's a difficult situation. It's fraught with a lot of emotion. And people have stark contrasts in what they think should happen on behalf of the people of Utah how we present our elected officials there, or candidates rather, to be voted upon and elected.

And so there's some divisiveness out there. I think it's understandable what's taken place. So, again, we can always improve, and I think we need to improve. We're going to bring the party together.

ROD DECKER, KUTV-2: The Salt Lake Tribune reports that Chairman Evans says he's looking forward. He expects to be on the ballot. He thinks that the Republican Party will use the rules as they're in the law now and will move forward.

I'm surprised you're not awarding victory to Count My Vote and the Legislature. It seems that the people who wanted to stop that say, "We're going forward." You've noted yourself that they're unlikely to win in court. Is this, in fact, all over but the shouting and even most of the shouting?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, again, I don't think all the last chapters have been written on this issue. For example, the unaffiliated voter aspect of this probably causes me—because I'm concerned. And at least from a legal standpoint, is it constitutional?

I appreciate the fact that the leadership of the party, Chairman Evans, is saying, "Hey, we're going to resolve this, and we're going to be on the ballot, and we're going to follow the law of Senate Bill 54 and become a qualified party."

I think that's good news. We still have probably some issues that need to be resolved and vetted. I expect that will happen. I know they've got a state central committee meeting coming up here at the end of this month. We'll have a convention I think at the end of the summer. And we have up until then to kind of resolve these issues entirely. I think that we're headed in the right direction.

I expect them to be resolved. And clearly we're going to have Republicans on the ballot, we'll have the support of the Republican Party for those who are Republicans running for office, and I think we'll have good outcomes come the 2016 November elections.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Governor, there's been some issues brought up regarding the Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control. There's been some complaints about low morale, low wages, problems like that.

Are you satisfied with the direction the DABC is going, especially when it comes to their employees and their overall policies?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, we take every complaint seriously.

Again, complaints are just kind of the nature of the business. No matter what you're doing, somebody is unhappy with results or the process, and wants to lodge a complaint. We take the complaints at the DABC seriously.

We've, in fact, turned that over to our HR department to review. They've done a review of that. They don't find anything untoward that's been taking place out there that would warrant any kind of disciplinary action.

Today, in fact, I've got members of my own staff going out with DABC to different liquor stores to interview the managers of the stores, to get from them first-hand information as far as “What do you like? What are you unhappy about? What are your suggestions for improvement”? I'll be talking to the public and seeing what the response is from the customers out there. And we need to listen to their concerns.

We have a new centralized distribution system, which is designed to make sure that we replenish our liquor stores based on what's being sold. It's a better accounting system. The legislative audit that was done shows that that process is improving our ability to stock correctly so that we have on supply what the consumer wants to have access to at our liquor stores.

So I feel like we're moving in the right direction. Are we where we need to be? Not necessarily, but I think we will get there.

And so, again, we're reviewing this very professionally. We want to make sure that we're doing the right thing based on the laws that we have on the books today.

Robert Gehrke, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: Wouldn't it be easier to just privatize these, contract out and let somebody else run the, rather than have the state involved in every aspect of it?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, it might be easier in some regards and maybe not as easy in others.

For example, last year we took in about $137 million net that goes into our system, our education system, and other needs. So to privatize it, you'd lose all that profitability, and so that may not be such a good thing.

That's a pretty big hole you'd have to fill. We clearly have an attitude in Utah not promoting alcohol consumption, just like we don't promote tobacco consumption, for health reasons.

It's a legal substance and so the concern would be if we had it privatized, there'd be some kind of promotion of alcohol consumption, which would maybe not be desirable. So I think the system works good. There's, you know, 16 or 17 other states that have state controlled liquor stores and alcohol control, so we're not so far out of step that some people say we are. And I think the system is working pretty good, so I don't know that it's broken and needs fixing.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX 13: Governor, Senator Madsen says that he's planning on bringing his medical cannabis bill back. What do you think about it?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, it doesn't surprise me.

He was adamant about it before. And again, we have a history of looking at opportunities for medicinal purposes to bring substances onboard that maybe historically have not been traditional medicine. Cannabis oil we passed here a year ago is helping people that have, you know, seizures.

And it seems to be demonstrating scientifically there's some benefit from the use of cannabis oil for those who have seizures. Medicinal marijuana, I think if it is based on good science, which we ought to make sure that it is, there needs to be a collaborative effort. And whatever proposal that the senator brings forward needs to be collaborative not only with the Legislature so that they understand what they're voting on, but also with our departments that have to execute the law.

And so our Department of Health, our Department of Human Services. It needs to be collaborated with the federal government so we're not in contrary with the federal laws.

As a controlled substance, I don't have a problem, but the question is, who's going to control it? Who's going to distribute it? What's going to be the quality and the quantity? And who makes those decisions? Those are issues that need to be—questions that need to be answered if we're going to move ahead with medical marijuana.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX 13: So are you open to the idea of medical cannabis in Utah?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I'm open to the idea of medical marijuana and the discussion of how it can be used as a medicine based on science and making sure that we have good collaborative effort so that we answer the questions that are out there regarding medical marijuana.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: Governor, you and legislative leaders were back in Washington recently to talk about Medicaid expansion. Two questions are, one, are you on track to meet your midsummer deadline of having a new proposal? And two, how closely will that proposal resemble your Healthy Utah plan?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, it's uncertain, you know, what the final product will be. That's why we're getting together to try to find areas of commonality and see if we can answer questions of concern. And so I don't want to predict the outcome yet.

I think we are on track. Everybody seems to be coming to the table with an open mind and a willingness to understand better each other's position. Really, it boils down, I think, to a major topic of capping the expenses.

It seems to be that the biggest concern is, can we cap the expenses? I believe we can. I think we've presented, in fact, some good ideas. We have accountable care organizations, for example, which allows us to pay less money for better outcomes to doctors.

It's not a fee for service like we traditionally have had, and so we can save money in that regard, which we are doing. We saved about $17 million this past year in our pilot program of accountable care organizations.

So there are ways that we can probably cap and predict the future costs of a Healthy Utah program or a Healthcare Utah program, whatever we want to name it.

So, I'm optimistic that we can answer the questions. I think we have got good headway in that regard. It'll be a collaborative effort between the executive branch and the House and the Senate, as well as the Department of Health in Washington, D.C.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: There's a suggestion that it'll closely end up resembling Healthy Utah, though, just because of all the work that you and your staff put into that.

But this new process allows the legislature maybe have some ownership of that and maybe have some input into small pieces of it, but overall people can still expect to see Healthy Utah. At least, that's what I've been hearing.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, and who knows? Maybe you're hearing things I'm not hearing.

I just hope for success. At the end of the day, we want to find some way to make sure that the taxpayers of Utah are not being taxed unnecessarily. If they want to repeal the taxes that we have to pay as Utahans under the Affordable Care Act, I'll be happy.

We can develop our own programs here in Utah better and keep the money here at home. I've told you before my first principle to Washington, D.C., is first, don't take our money. You have a limited scope of responsibility. Don't broaden that scope.

But if you do take the money, give it back to us and give it back to us with no strings, block grant form or with maximum flexibility. That's what we're trying to do. And we're spending a lot of money and at the present time getting no benefit out of it.

So we need to find a compromise where we can spend—we're mandatorily having to spend the money, but we get some benefit that doesn't jeopardize the taxpayers now or in the future. And again, I'm optimistic that we'll find a way to do that.

MICHAEL ORTON, UTAHPOLITICALCAPITOL.COM:Governor, while you were back in Washington, Speaker Hughes seemed to indicate that you were all waiting for a decision from the Supreme Court of the United States relative to the Affordable Care Act, and that that presupposed the reason why we were all waiting now until the end of June or thereabouts before any other action. Is that really what's going on here?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, it's certainly one of the factors. It could have an impact on what we decide is prudent moving forward, again, on behalf of the taxpayers and the people of Utah.

So it certainly could have a bearing, King versus Burwell is the lawsuit.

We should know that probably sometime in June what the outcome of that is going to be. I've talked to a lot of legal scholars. It's at best 50-50 either way you want to look at it. It'll be interesting to see what happens.

But if King prevails, that means it's going to take away the ability to access subsidized health care under what we have now under federal exchanges. And that's how people above 100% of poverty are accessing health care today. And that's part of what we've wanted to do here is just to go up to 100% and let those above 100% access the federal exchange.

If that's no longer a possibility, then it would warrant even more to have a program like Healthy Utah, where we have our own program to take those monies and put it into something else. So it's going to have a bearing on the discussion. Whether we'll have the absolute decision making thing, I think it's just one factor out of many.

BOB BERNICK, UTAHPOLICY.COM: Let me ask you, governor, about something personally as far as the Republican Party if I can go back to that. Would you be willing to pay $10,000 from your campaign into the Republican Party if you decide to take the petition route to it? And would you be willing to sit down with a truth commission and answer questions about whether you really are a Republican?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I'm really a Republican, and I always have been. I certainly subscribe to the party platform. And having me asked that question, "Do you subscribe and support the party platform?" is probably an appropriate question to ask me if I'm running as a Republican. I don't know that you need to sit before some kind of a purity panel. I've given way much more money than $10,000 to the party to keep it going and to help them keep the lights on, the doors open. So that wouldn't bother me much, but it's probably not good policy. We shouldn't have to pay a fee to become a Republican and to enter into the political fray.

In fact, we have laws on the books now that allow you to, if you're impoverished, to not even have to pay the filing fee and still get on the ballot. So I don't think we want to go down that pathway, but asking whether you support the Republican Party platform is probably a legitimate question. You've all heard the term RINO, a "Republican in name only."

And we know that there are people out there that, whether they be Democrats that say, "I can't win as a Democrat in my district, so I'll just be a moderate Republican. I don't really subscribe to the party platform," is probably a legitimate way to weed those folks out, at least in some kind of cursory way. Likewise, we have now a lot of Libertarians that can't win on the Libertarian ticket, and they're just saying, "Well, we're just extra conservative Republicans."

They're RINOs also. So again, I think—you know, I don't know that we need a purity test. We just need to have people that are good, traditional Republicans. I'm a Ronald Reagan Republican. If you agree with me 80% of the time, you're my friend.

BRADY MCCOMBS, ASSOCIATED PRESS: Governor, lawmakers have held a couple recent hearings to talk about police use-of-force protocols and guidelines in the state. What would you like to see done on that in light of the incidents we've seen elsewhere around the county?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, we need to make sure that our public safety officers have appropriate training.

We seem to be concerned about making sure they have appropriate resources and equipment, and that's good. Again, video cameras in the cars and body cameras on their person I think will help us make sure that we understand what takes place in a stop or an altercation.

I think that's going to keep everybody honest, or at least help them keep more honest. So I think those are steps in the right direction.

We need to make sure that we're having good training. How can you defuse a situation so it does not escalate? That's what we see I think too much out there is, not just in Utah, but probably across the country even more so, is if you have a situation, how can you diffuse it rather than have it escalate?

That's training, that's personality, that's demeanor, that's being professional. I think our police officers, by and large, do a wonderful job, and certainly here in Utah. We've got the best men and women in uniform in our public safety doing a great job.

And so a few bad actions should not reflect upon the overall body. You know, the half percent that cause a problem shouldn't reflect on the other 99.5%.

BRADY MCCOMBS, ASSOCIATED PRESS: Do you think the state should devote more money for that kind of de-escalation training?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I think so. Whatever is appropriate. And I look to the experts to tell us what is appropriate. Our Public Safety Commissioner Squires is doing a great job. We work in tangent with our local elected officials, our city mayors, and our police chiefs, our county commissioners, and the county sheriff.

It really is a collaborative effort to make sure we have a seamless public safety approach here in the state of Utah. And we need to make sure they have the resources necessary and the training necessary to fulfill their responsibilities.

Robert Gehrke, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: You can correct me if I'm wrong, but you requested some funding for body cameras for Highway Patrol, sort of started that process going, but I don't think it got funded if I'm right.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I think some of it did get funded.

And I think everybody's moving toward that. It's certainly something that I think would help.

Robert Gehrke, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: So you're proceeding—your impression is that they're proceeding toward that goal?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Yes, I know the local police chiefs and some of the sheriffs are doing the same thing.

It's always a matter of “Where do you get the money from?” And this is a new addition, a new expense to the budget, a necessary expense, and so you got to generate the revenue stream to fund it. We don't spend money we don't take in.

We live within our means here in Utah. That's why we're one of just a handful of states that have a AAA bond rating. So the fiscal aspects of this are not lost on me, but it's certainly one of those things that I think is in our future, better training and better equipment.

JUDY FAHYS, KUER: The Utah Foundation issued a report last week on education and education funding, and said that Utah's tax policies are affecting education programs here in the state.

Would you like to comment on that? Do we need to revamp our system?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, I think there's always room for discussion to see how things are working. I know we need to make sure we're comparing apples with apples.

You know, we're the lowest in the nation when it comes to per pupil spending. I don't know that that's necessarily anything to be proud of, but it shows we're not throwing a lot of money at the problem and we're getting a great bang for our buck. In fact, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce says education in Utah is the best value in America. And we're getting good outcomes. I see where our minority statistics in our education is now rising, maybe one of the best in America today. So we're having good outcomes even though we're spending less money.

But let me just remind everybody that because we have not raised taxes, particularly income taxes, which in Utah are all earmarked for education, our economy is probably the strongest economy in America today, most diverse, healthiest economy. And our private sector growth at about 4.7%, No. 1 in America. That produces a lot more revenue.

And so, consequently, this past legislative session, $512 million of new money, new money going into education. That's the most money in 27 years.

Over the last 4 years, because of having a healthy economy, we've been able to put over $1.4 billion of new money into education. So the system, although not perfect, our tax system has been conducive to economic growth and expansion, which is the rising tide that raises all boats on the pond, and in particular in Utah, education.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: Governor, a new poll shows that about 57% of Utahans want to see you re-elected. Is that where you want to be at this point in the campaign? You don't have a declared opponent, although there is someone who's hired a campaign manager.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, there's always people exploring, you know, the possibility of what if. And so I understand that. It's nice to have 57% approval rating for—not approval rating, for desire—to say I deserve re-election. Well, my approval rating is much higher. It's in the mid-70s. But it is a tough question: Do you deserve re-election? And it seems to bode well that our policies are working, we're having a successful effort on economic growth, the best in the nation.

Our education improvement is really taking hold and moving toward our 10-year plan that we're developing now, our infrastructure, whether it be roads or whether it be water, and what we're doing with our energy development. I mean, the list goes on and on. So our policies are working. I think that's why 57%. I wish it was 58%, said that Governor Herbert deserves re-election. I really am encouraged, though, because of the numbers with Republicans.

You know, 70% of the Republicans believe I deserve to be re-elected, so that bodes well for me in this quest to get a second full term in. And so I feel comfortable where we're at. You can always improve and we're going to continue to work hard as if we are very much an underdog, whoever decides to run against me, if anybody does.

ERIC NIELSEN, KUED: Governor, we're out of time. Thank you very much for joining us this month.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Thank you. Great to be with you, as always.

ANNOUNCER: This has been the governor's monthly news conference. An archive of transcripts, video, and audio is available online. Please visit kued.org. Thanks for joining us.

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