January 23, 2014

"I want you to know I'm very optimistic about the year ahead of us in Utah.  There's reason to be optimistic.  Our economy continues to grow and recover." -Governor Herbert on KUED

KUED presents the Governor's Monthly News Conference, an exchange between Utah reporters and Governor Gary Herbert. This program was recorded earlier.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Good morning.

KEN VERDOIA, KUED: Good morning, Governor.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: It's nice to be with you, and it's been a while, I know, since we've last had an opportunity to meet together, I think last November, so welcome once again. But let me take the opportunity to extend to you and to our viewers out there a happy new year.

I want you to know I'm very optimistic about the year ahead of us in Utah. There's reason to be optimistic. Our economy continues to grow and recover. We are at about 3.1% growth average right now in creating jobs, the second-fastest job creator in the nation. Unemployment is down to 4.3%. New numbers will come out tomorrow, and I'm cautiously optimistic that we'll have some good numbers tomorrow, too, but right now we're the fourth-lowest in the nation. I see us making strides when it comes to education. We've gathered around this goal of "66 by 2020," which I think is significantly important to us as a state, certainly for long-term economic growth and gains. That's an important thing, and I'm optimistic.

As you know, we're going to start the legislative session next Monday, and we're going tackle some tough issues, some difficult issues, and I think make, again, positive strides. So let me encourage, again, the viewers out there. We have a successful state because of the people. It requires involvement. It necessitates us all letting our views and positions to be known, so contact your legislature. Contact the governor's office. Let us know of your concerns, your issues. I would also counsel us all to do it in a respectful manner with civility, and understand that there are honest differences of opinion from people of good will as we go through this legislative process. But again, we've got a great state with great people, and again, this is a great new year, and I think Utah will again, like cream rising to the top, excel in every aspect of government and as community, and lead the nation in so many ways. So with that, I'm happy to take any questions that are on your mind.

KEN VERDOIA, KUED: Governor, you referenced that it's been two months since we last gathered in this setting, and those have been two very, very busy months. In fact, many people in the state view them as very chaotic months with developments. One of them that is at the fore is Utah now being thrust nationally to the forefront in the debate over same-sex marriage. A strategy is evolving for how Utah will approach its arguments in the federal court. Do you feel comfortable with the planning that's going into that presentation of Utah's case in the federal court system?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I do. I think the Attorney General's handling this appropriately. They've brought in counsel to help advise them. I think this case, which has significance, and could be a landmark case for not only Utah, but for the nation. I think we recognize that prominence and we want to have good arguments. And I would say good arguments on both sides of this issue, and we have a process that will allow us to bring kind of resolution and resolve to this issue. And I think Utah needs to put its best foot forward when it comes to defending our constitution and the statutes and the rules and the regulations that we have in Utah when it comes to same-sex marriage, and I would invite the opposition to do the same. We believe in the rule of law. We're going adhere to the rule of law. I think the pathway we have going forward is a sure path.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL-TV: In this environment, the legislature is expected to take up a non-discrimination law protection for same-sex couples, for homosexuals in the work place, in living environments. Are you inclined to support that kind of legislation, do you think, this year?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I've supported non-discriminatory statutes at our local levels in our cities. It started with Salt Lake City, and I think they came up with a good statute for that city. We've had since then, I think, another 17 or 18 other cities that have joined with that attempt for non-discrimination. So the idea of non-discrimination I support and endorse. I don't think we should discriminate in the workplace, in housing, based on sexual orientation. So I support the concept. We've always asked the question rhetorically, "Do we need to have a law to teach us to be good people, to make us be good people," and maybe some believe we do. Some believe we don't. But we see this evolution that's taking place. We'll see what happens in the legislative session as far as a statewide ordinance, and it depends on what's in the ordinance whether I would support it or not.

GLEN MILLS, ABC4: Governor, back to Amendment 3, I've heard both you and Attorney General Reyes say at the core is defending the will of the people of Utah. Do you believe today that that is the will of the people, or are you basing that specifically ten years ago when Amendment 3 passed?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, that's how you know the will of the people. They pass laws through their elected representatives, initiative petitions. There's a process where we understand as government officials, those who have been elected to enforce the law and to develop policy, that process is taking place. So we can only go what is on the books and what are the laws that have been created. There’s speculation that attitudes have changed. There's some polling that would indicate maybe that to be so, but we can't base our government based on polling. It's got to be based on the rule of law. So if there's opportunities to change laws, the people have that right through their elected representatives or initiating petitions, and we invite that to happen. We will defend the law that's on the books which we recognize as the will of the people. In fact, I've taken an oath of office to do that very thing.

GLEN MILLS, ABC4: And you think in this instance, it's worth the money it would cost to do so?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: It's a significant case. I mean, I don't think anybody does not recognize the magnitude of what we're talking about here. So sure, it's certainly worth defending our own constitution and the will of the people of Utah. It's also an important on a national stage that we have good dialogue and discussion and debate so that we can bring a resolution to the issue. It certainly is important. And again, the cost is not as significant as people have been saying. To go through the appeals of the Tenth Circuit Court now looks like it's going cost us about $300,000.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: But Governor, the reason that cost is reduced is because of the involvement of an outside organization in the selection of the attorney and in the strategy the attorney's going to take. As you know, the Sutherland Institute indicated they would pick up the tab for the legal costs, if indeed they got the lawyer they wanted and the strategy they wanted. They did. They got the lawyer. They seem to feel they have the strategy. And rather than actually pick up the cost, the attorney's capped his cost, and Sutherland Institute is paying him separately to be a fellow, I believe, in the organization. Is that something you're comfortable with, outside groups having that kind of influence on the lawyers that represent all of us as Utahns?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: If what you said is true, and I think it's maybe not exactly accurate, that the Sutherland Institute has picked the attorney. I think that is wrong.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: But they have influence, though, on that choice.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: We have a lot of people out there that have influence on what should be done. The question we should ask, have we hired a good attorney? I don't care what the motivation is or if somebody enticed them to come and live in Utah. I care about the quality of the performance of the attorney. And Mr. Schaerr, I think, has got impeccable credentials as far as his skill as an attorney. And I expect that the Attorney General, Sean Reyes, did the hiring. Now, whether he's getting some help and some extra motivation, I'm not privy to that. I do not want any outside influence on the Attorney General's office. I want the Attorney General, Sean Reyes, to make those decisions as far as how we're going approach it, what our legal strategy is, and our court.

Now, he's got this new attorney and a couple of other guys that are going help them with that strategy, and I think that's perfectly fine. And I would note that the opposition's doing the same thing. They're bringing in outside attorneys, broadening their legal team to help put their best arguments forward. That's how the process should work, and I think that represents the people and all sides of this issue in a very professional manner.

ROD DECKER, KUTV: Granted that marriage between one man and one woman is the will of the people and the law of the state of Utah, what is the best reason why we don't just say, "You guys do what you want. We'll do what we want." What is the best reason to outlaw gay marriage?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, fortunately, I don't have to make that argument. That's already been debated. That was part of the Amendment 3. We had a rigorous, thoughtful debate on Amendment 3. And we had people, Republicans, Democrats that supported, Republicans, Democrats that were opposed to it for a variety of reasons. So that discussion and debate is over with. That train has left the station, and so we have a law on the books we have to defend.

ROD DECKER, KUTV: The judge, Judge Shelby, said there isn't a good reason. That's why he struck it down. There's no rational basis. So it isn't entirely over. It's moved to court. Is there a good reason? Is there a rational basis?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, sure. The people of Utah have said that that is part of the law. That is a rational basis. We have a history. We have precedent. We have even our own constitution. As Utah became a state, we had to define marriage at one man and one woman. So there's a lot of rational basis for why we have the law on the books that we're defending. Now, again, I recognize, we all recognize now, that at least one man, an unelected individual, who's taken and connected dots in such a way that he says, "Well, I think this is unconstitutional under the U.S. Constitution." Mind you, he's the first federal judge in history to make that determination. Again, the debate continues and goes on. We have a process, Rod, to resolve that, and let's let the process play forward and the courts ultimately will make the decision on whether it's constitutional or not.

ROD DECKER, KUTV: Do you remember a reason that really appealed to you back when we debated it?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I can tell you, like the vast majority of people in another 32 states believe that the definition of marriage is one man and one woman, I do, also.

MAX ROTH, FOX-13: Your opinion matters. You were elected as the chief executive of this state, and so tell us why? What is your reasoning for believing that marriage is between one man and one woman?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: A lot of things go into individual belief. Again, what my foundation and individual belief really is not relevant today.

MAX ROTH, FOX-13: But you're the elected leader of the state.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I'm the elected leader who's sworn to defend the constitution and the laws of the Utah and the United States. The people have spoken. Let me just reference, you know, backwards. When we had a Democrat Attorney General, when Mike Leavitt, a Republican, was the governor. There was a contentious debate on abortion. Again, our Democrat Attorney General said even though she was pro-choice, she said, "I will defend the laws of Utah," and that's the way it should be. You know, the debate's over. The decision's been made, and doesn't matter what my motivation is for how I vote for this or that or the other thing. Those are the laws that we have on the gooks through the democratic process that we have to defend. It's that simple to me.

MAX ROTH, FOX-13: But this is an ongoing public debate, mentioned non-discrimination. It's sure to come up in the legislature. Could wind up on your desk, so your opinion on homosexuality, on same-sex marriage, is clearly part of an ongoing public process, and so it matters what you think and what you base that decision on.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: What matters more importantly is I'm willing to defend the law. I'm a representative of the people. Again, we live in a democratic republic, and we ought not to forget that. We have some states out there that are forgetting that they need to represent the people, taking a pass on defending laws, because they pick and choose what they think is right or wrong. That's not the way it should work. Again, we all have our own makeup and reasons for how we vote the way we do. There will be rigorous debate out there, I expect. Many in our religious community will step in. Those who are in the in the religious community, others out there, will say, "For the good of the whole, this is my point of view." My job is to enforce the law.

DAM BAMMES, KUER: Governor, are you referring to the Virginia Attorney General when you say there are states out there making these decisions without the people?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I'm not picking on anybody specifically. But again, the Attorney General of Virginia, I know, has said, "I'm not going enforce the law." We saw Governor Brown and his people in California decide not to enforce the law that came up from the people. I think that's wrong. I think that's on very dangerous, in fact, footing, where we have elected officials picking and choosing which laws that they're going to enforce that have been given to them by the people. I think that's wrong. That's dangerous. That's the next step to dictatorship. We're not going do that in Utah. The will of the people, we've heard them speak. There's been debate on it, and are we are going follow the rule of law wherever it takes us.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL-5: In spite of your role as governor in defending the law, has this debate and the judge's ruling sparked you to think about this issue a little bit more, to maybe even struggle with it?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, I think it causes us all to have reflection. You know, I've had an opportunity to meet with the members of the gay community on many occasions, as recently as yesterday. Again, I have an opportunity. I host a gathering at the governor's mansion of the gay community once a year. Again, I have empathy for their plight. I have empathy for their joy, and the confusion that's been created because of the Shelby ruling and what's taking place here. That's why we wanted to have a stay, to kind of through this. Let it evolve and probably get greater understanding, certainly about the impact it has on all the different myriad of laws we have in the state of Utah.

So I think it's time for reflection and, you know, again, let me just say this, that, you know, the gay community, for all of us, they are our neighbors. They are our friends. They're our relatives. They deserve our respect. We should be kind and courteous. We should make sure that this issue, although controversial, is not contentious. It shouldn't be. Others are making it contentious. I understand the controversy, but all of us need to be civil in our comments and our discussion. It does not add to the dialogue for some of these shrill, name-calling comments on all sides of the issue. So let's make sure we have a civil discourse as we debate this issue.

ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: When you have these discussions with your gay friends or the gay people, gay couples that you've met with, how do you articulate to them that this is justice that you're seeking here? That they shouldn't be able to be married, that they shouldn't be able to be wed and raise children in that union?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, again, I think most of the gay community understands the history behind it. And certainly the history, we have not had any state promote and accept same-sex marriage here until 2003. You know, we haven't had hardly any--in fact, I don't know of any country until the 1990s that had same-sex marriage, so there's a lot of history behind the definition of what marriage is as predominantly heterosexual and one man and one woman. So I think they understand that. They were just saying, "Hey, it's time for us to have an opportunity to just marry the one we love." Others are saying that's not under the constitution. It's not a right found in the federal constitution, and that's the debate that's going on right now.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: But how do you articulate to them that your feeling, the actions that you're taking that might prevent them to--

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I've not had to articulate--I'm not trying to convince anybody to believe it my way, from the standpoint of people who have a diametrically opposite point of view. But I think we can have those discussions and still have appreciation, love for one another as part of the fabric of Utah and part of the family of Utah, whether we have a difference of opinion on the definition of marriage or not.

Clearly the people involved in gay relationships are together. They're loving each other. They're taking care of each other, just like people in other families and traditional families are doing, and it has been working. Can we improve? I guess that's part of the debate, but again, at the end of the day, for the Governor of Utah, it's about, "This is the law and I have an obligation to defend the law." I was a supporter of Amendment 3 as an individual. I think that's the best way to have family arrangements and best chance for children to be the best they can be, is a man and a woman, husband and wife, father and mother.

KEN VERDOIA, KUED: When the decision was handed down by Judge Shelby, and then national media converges on Utah and conveys images of hundreds and hundreds of people lining up in public settings to be married. What was your reaction? I mean, what was your sense of call to order, "This is what I must do?"

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, again, it was not hard for me to understand that we need to follow the law. I've been a "rule of law" guy from the beginning. And I don't know if shock's the right term, but I was certainly surprised, and the reason I was surprised, because I'm in the process of interviewing people for Attorney General. And you know, all the issues that are on the table there to be addressed, and then to find that the decision had been made on a Friday afternoon just going into Christmas, when the anticipation was further discussion on January the 7th, it was a surprise and a disappointment.

I did not think it was appropriate for Judge Shelby to make that decision the way that he did. Again, there should have been a stay. He should understand as the judge and exercise some wisdom in the process that, "This is a significant decision I'm making, first in history, as a federal court judge, to determine under the U.S. constitution that there's a right to same-sex marriage." And you'd think that wisdom would dictate, "We need to go through this process so we can have this thorough and complete."

That's why we wanted a stay. And of course, other people, you know, "Hey, a window of opportunity," they rushed in there. It's caused a lot of confusion and chaos. It's not any secret we wanted a stay. We eventually got the stay with the Supreme Court. And again, I am empathetic to the confusion it's caused for the uncertainty for the people. But boy, we're breaking new ground here. We have to adhere to the law. We had a law on the books, then we had a law taken off the books, and then with the Supreme Court stay, we've gone back now to pre-Shelby, and that's how we have to administer the benefits going forward. It's frozen things time, and again, the courts will have to probably help sort through some of this stuff. But it's a confusing time, because of that, for a lot of people.

ROD DECKER, KUTV: Do you know when you're going to announce whether we'll expand Medicaid?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Yeah, this legislative session. I've come to the decision. I've analyzed it very thoroughly, and I can tell you this. Doing nothing, which has been an option on the table, I've taken off the table. Doing nothing is not an option. We have about 60,000 people in the state of Utah that live below the poverty line which, because of just flaws in the Affordable Care Act, will not have the coverage that is necessary for them to access good health care. In fact, the flaw means that people making more money, above poverty, will have access to better health care than this group of people that are below poverty. That's not right. It's not fair, and I'm going work with the legislature to find a solution to that problem. We have 45 days, and we will have a solution by the end of this session.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL-5: Governor, talk about air quality really quickly. You're administration has taken steps forward and you've established a panel to study it. But there's a lot of people who strongly feel that you don't really need to take much to look outside and see the inversion, you know, to feel that something needs to be done. Is there something that can be done immediately, in your view, other than telling people that they shouldn't drive?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, you minimize the thing about tailpipes, but 60% of the gunk out there comes out of our tailpipes, so telling people to be prudent in how they utilize their vehicles is an important part of what we can do to solve the problem. Again, it doesn't take much to look out and see there's gunk in the air, and boy, I'm as frustrated as anybody, and we clearly need to do something about it. But therein lies the challenge, to do what? We can't change the weather patterns much. We can't change the inversions, but we can change the emissions.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL-5: But is the state sending mixed messages by decreasing--you know, I mean, DAQ has limited staff. They're doing more with less. Funding for UTA, UTA is running on a business model right now. Hundreds of millions of dollars every year are pumped into transportation. So we're investing in transportation, but yet we're telling people not to drive. That seems confusing.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, again, let me just go back there, Rich, and say effectively using the taxpayers' dollars is certainly a smart thing to do. Government has a voracious appetite for taxpayers' dollars and can spend it hither and yon in areas that probably are not well-spent. Air quality issues and our environmental issues are certainly an area that's emerging. There's a renewed emphasis, and probably a renewed awareness of the air quality issues. And we're not only doing best available technology requirements now on our industry. They’re going spend hundreds of millions of dollars in what they're doing.

We do have a team called the Clean Air Action Team designed to have people come and say, "I've got some ideas." We have a lot of ideas that come into our office. Some of them are not realistic. Some of 'em have got some good ideas. We need to vet those things, give people an opportunity to have a forum, and see if we can convert that to rules, regulations, legislation. I see that we have a bipartisan group that just had a press conference yesterday, talking about what 15 or 18 different bills are being proposed. I have some ideas I'm going to propose during my State of the State. Next Wednesday, you'll all be there, won't you? State of the State next Wednesday, we'll talk about some things that I think we can do immediately to help with the air quality. But it's going to take everybody, industry, individuals, and we can't just keep pointing to somebody else to fix the problem. It's going to be all of us working together if we really are serious about cleaning up the air.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL-5: So you have a sense of urgency about this?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Absolutely. I understand that it hurts our health and it hurts our economic opportunities out there. We have these three months of inversion that are just terrible, and you know, people don't like to go outside. When I recruit businesses to come here and they see the gunk in the air, it's not as an attractive place. So I get it, and we just need to find rational, reasonable ways to address it. And that's what we're doing, and we've reduced, you know, a lot of tonnage of pollution just in this past year, but we have more to do. We have 20, on average, bad days a year, which is 20 bad days of air we don't want to have.

ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: Governor, polling has recently showed that there's support among Utahans for civil unions, short of gay marriage. Is that something you'd be open to addressing? Do you think it's time to look at that as an option?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, in light of the Shelby decision and what's taking place, it's again an opportunity to reflect and review. And so if there's other ways to get from here to there that can be the common ground approach and find the proverbial win/win, let's take a look at it. Clearly, the Amendment 3 we have on the books today does not allow that. The second part of that says, "Anything that like unto cannot be viewed as marriage." So we've got to get past the law that's on the books now. If there's other ways to address the issue that people can feel good about, that's part of the public square debate. And again, clearly we're going to have that debate.

KEN VEROIA, KUED: Governor, we only have about one minute left in our time today, and I have to take it back here so I can control the time just slightly. I want to ask you a question. We've talked at the outset about the good news of Utah. We've talked about the challenges Utah is facing. But as an objective observer, some people might view this as the most challenging 60-day period of your term as governor. Would you agree, and how have you tried to singularly address these challenges as they come from many different sources?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I'm comfortable in my own skin. You know, the principles and values I espoused when I ran for governor have not changed to fit the circumstances. I just stay true to my values and principles, and I think we'll get the right outcome. It seems to have been working the last four and a half years, so whether this is the most challenging 60 days in my tenure, I'm not certain. There's a lot of challenges we've had over the past years. I am very optimistic as we go forward in the future. I've never been more optimistic about Utah's future ever in my life. And so again, some of these will have a little more national prominence. Probably a little more headline worthy. But we'll address them as we work together, and that's the key thing, is all of us need to work together. We'll find solution to all of the challenges we face.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Governor, thank you for your time. A reminder, transcripts and video playback of this are available online at KUED.org. Thanks for joining us.

This has been the Governor's monthly news conference. An archive of transcripts, video, and audio is available online. Please visit KUED.org. Thanks for joining us.

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